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Author Topic: USA playing De-Stalinization  (Read 4999 times)

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Julio

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USA playing De-Stalinization
« on: June 05, 2013, 02:32:02 am »
+1

Turn 3.
Letís assume you play with USA and have been holding De-Stalinization to discard it in Turn 3 as usual. You now realize that USSR player holds CIA Created and it happens that you also have 5 Year Plan in your hand. You have also China Card.

- USSR coups in AR1 lowering DEFCON to 2, as usual.
- You play De-Stalinization for ops. If USSR puts influence in Southamerica battlegrounds, as usual, you then play 5YP in AR2 hopping to not discard CIA and winning the game by DEFCON suicide. 80% of success.

The only way out for USSR is to play UN Intervention, so you should also hold it in your hand to be completely sure.
USSR may also avoid DEFCON suicide by playing Nuclear Test Ban as event, but in this case USSR losts a 4Ops card and USA is able to coup a battleground, getting access to Southamerica too.

If USSR uses De-Stalinization to put influence in non-battleground countries, USA has free coup targets to get military operations and access to the region.

What do you think of this use of De-Stalinization?
Have you ever win a game setting this trap?

« Last Edit: June 05, 2013, 03:08:44 am by Julio »
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DeDaan

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Re: USA playing De-Stalinization
« Reply #1 on: June 05, 2013, 02:49:25 am »
+1

Yes, a very good trap. I once did it with Decolonization, since Fidel was out. My opponent bit by putting 1 IP in Algeria, which gave me the DEFCON win in turn 3. But of course Destalinization can be used in the same way. 
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Chimista

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Re: USA playing De-Stalinization
« Reply #2 on: June 05, 2013, 04:37:41 am »
0

Last week I had the oportunity to put in play the 5YP-CIA combo (Maybe combo is not the right word, since the other player is the one who must hold CIA, but anyway...). In my case I used Fidel to get USSR ip's in the Midwar Regions, which I think is stronger, as De-Stal and Decol influence can be played in non-BG's, as mentioned, by a cunning USSR player. I've seen USSR placing inf in Costa Rica, Paraguay, Uruguay, Morocco, Tunisia, Botswana, etc.


Obviously a cunning USSR player who is holding CIA w/o chinese protection in T3 and knows US can have 5YP in his hand might prevent major risks by playing CIA in AR1: sacrificing a BG coup is not a big price to make sure you make it to T4!
« Last Edit: June 05, 2013, 04:39:50 am by Chimista »
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Julio

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Re: USA playing De-Stalinization
« Reply #3 on: June 05, 2013, 05:39:05 am »
0

What I want to discuss is if using De-Stalinization for the 5YP-CIA combo is a good idea or not.  :)
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DeDaan

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Re: USA playing De-Stalinization
« Reply #4 on: June 05, 2013, 06:02:44 am »
0

Hmmm, I think Chimista just explained this. It depends if you have got a cunning opponent or not. If he's aware of the danger of using Destalinization to go into battlegrounds, it's better not to use it, since it gives him a major advantage in the America regions. In that case you have got no advantage of CIA Created and he does, being everywhere in the world. If your opponent goes into battlegrounds (like what happens with Fidel), it's a good trap.

Personally I won't take the risk if I don't need to. In the case I described I had both Destal and Decol and I had to get rid of one of them anyway, so I decided to give him Decol which proved to lead to a DEFCON win. But that could have been also disastrous if he wouldn't have gone to at least one battleground.

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Julio

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Re: USA playing De-Stalinization
« Reply #5 on: June 05, 2013, 06:37:51 am »
0

If he's aware of the danger of using Destalinization to go into battlegrounds, it's better not to use it, since it gives him a major advantage in the America regions.

If he does so, you get coup targets for getting military operation and a way to access Southamerica. You can even coup using De-Stalinization and later in the turn moving into Southamerica battlegrounds while USSR must first play CIA if he wants to do the same.

I do not think it is a disastrous scenario.
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Kazzy

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Re: USA playing De-Stalinization
« Reply #6 on: June 05, 2013, 07:06:46 am »
+1

This happened to me as USSR by accident when I was teaching someone the game - not good!
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Chimista

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Re: USA playing De-Stalinization
« Reply #7 on: June 05, 2013, 07:43:53 am »
0

If he's aware of the danger of using Destalinization to go into battlegrounds, it's better not to use it, since it gives him a major advantage in the America regions.

If he does so, you get coup targets for getting military operation and a way to access Southamerica. You can even coup using De-Stalinization and later in the turn moving into Southamerica battlegrounds while USSR must first play CIA if he wants to do the same.

I do not think it is a disastrous scenario.

Maybe you got a point there, worth a deeper analysis. Say you play De-Stal, USSR places ips in Morocco, Botswana, Paraguay and Urugay, i.e. You use the 3 ops to coup Uruguay, with 3-4 you get inf in Uruguay, then USSR plays CIA and lets you play first: you coup Paraguay and need a 4 or more to get him out, but still possible. Then he can place 1 ip in Angola. Next turn you can take Argentina and Brazil, if you have enough ip's, and he can continue spreading in Africa or coup back in SA trying to get access. In a worse scenario you could fail your coups and get USSR presence in both SA and Africa.

I'd say playing Destal to set up a CIA trap is too risky against an advanced player, and would rather space it, but it could work with many average players. Would be nice to see other opinions.
« Last Edit: June 05, 2013, 07:45:46 am by Chimista »
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MarlesChartel

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Re: USA playing De-Stalinization
« Reply #8 on: June 06, 2013, 12:45:39 am »
+1

Theoretical situation:
You are USA, Turn 2 AR6. You have the China Card.
CIA created, and one of FYP/Duck and Cover haven't come out yet (you have the other), but Fidel and decol have come and gone without occurring.

You play De-stal, intending to give the USSR an opportunity to move into mid war battlegrounds. That way, if CIA created and the one of FYP and D+C have gone to the right player (CIA him, FYP/D+C you), then you can headline D+C, and AR1 play FYP to guarantee victory.
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Julio

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Re: USA playing De-Stalinization
« Reply #9 on: June 06, 2013, 02:07:56 am »
0

Theoretical situation:
You are USA, Turn 2 AR6. You have the China Card.
CIA created, and one of FYP/Duck and Cover haven't come out yet (you have the other), but Fidel and decol have come and gone without occurring.

You play De-stal, intending to give the USSR an opportunity to move into mid war battlegrounds. That way, if CIA created and the one of FYP and D+C have gone to the right player (CIA him, FYP/D+C you), then you can headline D+C, and AR1 play FYP to guarantee victory.

That's even riskier.
You do not know for sure how the cards are gonna be dealt next turn. And URSS still can get UN Intervention or Nuclear Test Ban.
« Last Edit: June 06, 2013, 07:10:02 am by Julio »
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DeDaan

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Re: USA playing De-Stalinization
« Reply #10 on: June 06, 2013, 06:38:43 am »
0

Agree. It's so rare that the cards will be dealt exactly the way you want. I wouldn't risk playing Destal the turn before the situation (maybe) occurs.
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