Twilight Strategy Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

Download the Twilight Strategy e-book!

Pages: [1]

Author Topic: Tie-break  (Read 2749 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

pietshaq

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 262
  • Wargameroom username: WojciechPietrzak_TS
  • Respect: +46
    • View Profile
    • My Twilight Struggle blog
Tie-break
« on: June 28, 2013, 09:10:14 am »
0

Hi!

Suppose a decisive (by any meaning) game ends up with 0VPs after Final Scoring and you have no outer tie-breaks at your disposal (such as previous games or games against other people). What kind of tie-break would you suggest to make it as fair as possible and not too long?

My friend suggested nullifying Final Scoring, playing the extra Turn and Final Scoring again (provided the game won't end during the extra Turn any other way). What do you think?
Logged
If you find my contribution useful, please donate some Bitcoins: 1LTicKy5ww4tAQwLqRDHxbpKHBQ9QvcK72
My Twilight Struggle blog

Eruantalon

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 53
  • Wargameroom username: Janusz_Wójciak
  • Respect: +14
    • View Profile
Re: Tie-break
« Reply #1 on: June 28, 2013, 09:59:18 am »
0

Add Ops of removed events for USSR and USA separately. Whoever's sum is lower - wins (it means, less of his events has been used).

Look for unused Scoring cards in deck - score those regions (mitigate the bad luck, of not having "your" region scored)

Count BG countries, scoring double for adjacency/Count all countries

Announce USA wins (if up to 1 extra inf awarded), USSR wins (if more then 1 extra inf awarded).
Logged

Jayne Starlancer

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 35
  • Hero of Canton
  • Respect: +9
    • View Profile
Re: Tie-break
« Reply #2 on: June 28, 2013, 10:17:48 am »
0

There needs to be some crazy "Sudden Death" round you can play after Final Scoring to break ties.
Logged

pietshaq

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 262
  • Wargameroom username: WojciechPietrzak_TS
  • Respect: +46
    • View Profile
    • My Twilight Struggle blog
Re: Tie-break
« Reply #3 on: June 28, 2013, 11:35:13 am »
0

Add Ops of removed events for USSR and USA separately. Whoever's sum is lower - wins (it means, less of his events has been used).

Look for unused Scoring cards in deck - score those regions (mitigate the bad luck, of not having "your" region scored)

Count BG countries, scoring double for adjacency/Count all countries

Announce USA wins (if up to 1 extra inf awarded), USSR wins (if more then 1 extra inf awarded).

I don't like the first option. Stronger events not necessarily have more Ops (to make them less mitigable if played by opponent). For example, at DEFCON 3 We Will Bury You becomes very powerful card for the US as T10AR7 play (which it is even without this rule).

The second option has the biggest chance to be an empty one if no Scoring Card remains, and the biggest chance not to break the tie.

The third one is like some kind of doubling the Final Scoring which I don't like.

The last one is the only one that guarantees to break the tie and it fulfils my feeling of justice but it's tenseless since you know from the beginning of the game on who's favor will the tie be broken.

I'm looking for some kind of sudden death but requiring some more moves to be made.
Logged
If you find my contribution useful, please donate some Bitcoins: 1LTicKy5ww4tAQwLqRDHxbpKHBQ9QvcK72
My Twilight Struggle blog

Jayne Starlancer

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 35
  • Hero of Canton
  • Respect: +9
    • View Profile
Re: Tie-break
« Reply #4 on: June 28, 2013, 09:43:28 pm »
0

What if you played one more turn... maybe only 5 action rounds.

And what if both players wrote down one region that would be scored at the end of that round? Then it becomes a tense, bluff-counter-bluff... problem is that it could still end in a tie! Also, too possible that regions could be too hard to break opponent's control to make it more than just 5 turns of nothing and then score again.

But I think this is somewhere in the right direction...
Logged

Panda Kwong

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1
  • Respect: 0
    • View Profile
Re: Tie-break
« Reply #5 on: June 28, 2013, 11:20:44 pm »
0

I'm not sure if this is what you're looking for, but I would recommend the following mantra: ignore all rules and obey common sense. I suggest referencing board position and determining which superpower would, realistically, have a greater advantage on the board. I understand that by definition, a draw in VPs would mean a very tense board, but is Angola REALLY worth the same as West Germany, even if nominally they are both worth 1 VP? A domination of Asia might score 6 VPs, which is around the same as an Africa domination with no enemy presence, but which is more valuable? If in reality a Soviet General Secretary had unified Korea under the Kims, overcome the radical Islamism in Pakistan with socialist revolution and then prompted the Pakistanis to invade India successfully, I suspect the Politburo would be happy to overlook the Americans setting up proxy insurgencies in Angola and Zaire. Of course, your views may be different, so perhaps you could work out some principles to work with. Perhaps some for me might be:

1. See who real-life regional powers belong to. I think that, petroleum aside, we can agree that Brazil's role in the SA region is more important than Venezuela's.

2. Consider whether the Early War regions might be biased more heavily to one side than the other. I'm really not an expert, but I think the USSR sponsored many Third World insurgencies in the final years of the Cold War even when it's backyard imploded. In my opinion the Old World could be weighed slightly more.

3. Assess (inter-)regional dynamics. I think a Soviet France surrounded by American satellites is living on borrowed time, but if the Soviets also controlled Algeria then it might have a good hinterland.

4. Stability and security threats. Once again you can disagree, but I think an American Poland would be a big threat to USSR domestic interests-- that's why it's worth one more point. But likewise we can consider that a Soviet-controlled Middle East would be a greater threat to the US than a US-controlled Latin America to the USSR because while the US' oil supplies and trading routes would be in severe jeopardy, the USSR might only be missing out on some markets and opportunities to pressure the US.

I'm sorry for rambling on my first post, and also if this approach seems a bit nonsensical or unworkable to you, but I hope I at least provided some advice. Incidentally, do you have a map of that game?
Logged

pietshaq

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 262
  • Wargameroom username: WojciechPietrzak_TS
  • Respect: +46
    • View Profile
    • My Twilight Struggle blog
Re: Tie-break
« Reply #6 on: June 29, 2013, 04:52:36 am »
0

Two ideas came to my mind yesterday in the evening :)

1. A non-further-play variation (may still lead to draw)
Nullify Final Scoring. Then count every adjacency between two battlegrounds controlled by the same superpower as an extra battleground controlled by the same superpower. Then count Final Scoring again.
If either of the battlegrounds is adjacent to enemy superpower, the extra adjacency battleground is adjacent too. One battleground my generate more than one adjacency battlegrounds.
Example: USA controls Japan and both Koreas. The Asia Scoring is counted as if the US had two more battlegrounds (Koreas adjacency + South Korea-Japan adjacency), and one more country adjacent to USSR controlled (North Korea adjacency to South Korea) for a total of at least 3VPs, maybe more if this affects domination.
The interregional adjacency counts as an extra battleground in more stable region by DEFCON restriction meanings. This means in particular that Iran-Pakistan adjacency counts for Asia and France-Algieria adjacency counts for Europe.

2. A further-play variation
Let's call 20VPs the 'autovictory margin' which is necessary to auto-win. This variation will change the margin so for the rest of the game the autovictory is achieved by being ahead of at least the current autovictory margin VPs. It doesn't matter whether the advantage was achieved as a result of achieving VPs or as a result of changing the autovictory margin. Of course, the game may still be ended in any other way.
Play the extra Turn 11 with unlimited number of rounds and with special rules. At the beginning of the round remove China Card from play permanently. Do the things from the following list in the following order as long as no winner is determined. Scoring Cards nolonger may not be held.
  • Declare next sub-turn start
  • If you have just started the first/fifth/ninth/.../4*x+1st sub-turn, increase DEFCON by 1
  • If you have just started the second/sixth/tenth/.../4*x+2nd sub-turn, set Space Race markers for spacing allowed for both players
  • If you have just started the third/seventh/eleventh/.../4*x+3rd sub-turn, check Mil-Ops, give VPs for Mil-Ops if applicable and reset Mil-Ops
  • If you have just started the fourth/eighth/twelveth/.../4*x sub-turn, de-activate all the active "for the remainder of the turn" cards
  • If autovictory margin is higher than 5, subtract 1 from autovictory margin
  • If autovictory margin is still higher than 10, subtract another 1 from autovictory margin
  • Draw cards so that each player has three cards (do not grab cards if player already has more)
  • Pick one card each and play those cards as if it was headline phase
  • USSR plays one card the way you play cards during the Action Round
  • USA plays one card the way you play cards during the Action Round
  • Go back to step one
Logged
If you find my contribution useful, please donate some Bitcoins: 1LTicKy5ww4tAQwLqRDHxbpKHBQ9QvcK72
My Twilight Struggle blog

Brainstrainer61

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1
  • Wargameroom username: Brainstrainer61
  • Respect: 0
    • View Profile
Re: Tie-break
« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2017, 01:05:26 pm »
0

Friends, if the game is tied at 0 VP after 10 intense game-turns, acknowledging skillful plays from both players, then the best and fairest tie-break is the simplest.

Each player Rolls One Die, and High Roll Wins!  :o  :o
Logged
Pages: [1]
 

Page created in 0.086 seconds with 21 queries.